 | Blogs > jeffpilot > I Am Not The Barber Of Seville > The Real McCain: Former POW and Naval Academy classmate of John McCain |
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jeffpilot
8/20/2008 11:02 am |
From the AlterNet site. ------------------------------------------------- The Real McCain, according to fellow Vietnam POW and U.S. Naval Academy classmate Phillip Butler Fellow Naval Academy classmate and POW of John McCain Phillip Butler is now saying the Great Unmentionable. ***** John was a wild man. He was funny, with a quick wit and he was intelligent. But he was intent on breaking every USNA regulation in our 4 inch thick USNA Regulations book. And I believe he must have come as close to his goal as any midshipman who ever attended the Academy. John had me "coming around" to his room frequently during my plebe year. And on one occasion he took me with him to escape "over the wall" in the dead of night. He had a taxi cab waiting for us that took us to a bar some 7 miles away. John had a few beers, but forbid me to drink (watching out for me I guess) and made me drink cokes. I could tell many other midshipman stories about John that year and he unbelievably managed to graduate though he spent the majority of his first class year on restriction for the stuff he did get caught doing. In fact he barely managed to graduate, standing 5th from the bottom of his 800 man graduating class. I and many others have speculated that the main reason he did graduate was because his father was an Admiral, and also his grandfather, both U.S. Naval Academy graduates [...] John was awarded a Silver Star and Purple Heart for heroism and wounds in combat. This heroism has been played up in the press and in his various political campaigns. But it should be known that there were approximately 600 military POW's in Vietnam. Among all of us, decorations awarded have recently been totaled to the following: Medals of Honor - 8, Service Crosses - 42, Silver Stars - 590, Bronze Stars - 958 and Purple Hearts - 1,249. John certainly performed courageously and well. But it must be remembered that he was one hero among many - not uniquely so as his campaigns would have people believe. I furthermore believe that having been a POW is no special qualification for being President of the United States. The two jobs are not the same, and POW experience is not, in my opinion, something I would look for in a presidential candidate. Most of us who survived that experience are now in our late 60's and 70's. Sadly, we have died and are dying off at a greater rate than our non-POW contemporaries. We experienced injuries and malnutrition that are coming home to roost. So I believe John's age (73) and survival expectation are not good for being elected to serve as our President for 4 or more years. I can verify that John has an infamous reputation for being a hot head. He has a quick and explosive temper that many have experienced first hand. Folks, quite honestly that is not the finger I want next to that red button. It is also disappointing to see him take on and support Bush's war in Iraq, even stating we might be there for another 100 years. For me John represents the entrenched and bankrupt policies of Washington-as-usual. The past 7 years have proven to be disastrous for our country. And I believe John's views on war, foreign policy, economics, environment, health care, education, national infrastructure and other important areas are much the same as those of the Bush administration. ***** Wow. It's stunning to see someone who knows McCain lay this all out so specifically. And he hits everything -- the age, the temper, the flyboy antics, the policies right in line with Bush. It's all there. He should have some fun with his newfound not-stardom, with all the not-appearing on corporate news programs and not-being cited in the corporate print media. If Liberals really hated America, we'd all vote Republican. |
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8/27/2008 4:50 am |
jeff....I see msgrambo's profile is turned off...do ya suppose she is busy at the convention? lol  MHOFollow the Golden Rule...
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8/26/2008 5:12 pm |
jeff....I see msgrambo's profile is turned off...do ya suppose she is busy at the convention? lol
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8/26/2008 3:03 pm |
Sarcasm is not necessary Jeff, I would vote for Hillary over Obama for a lot of reasons. She did get the popular vote, wonder why that was? Some men think a gravel voice is sexy, even so her voice change was from campaigning, not her normal voice. What she says is more important than how she sounds. I like her...Friends? If Liberals really hated America, we'd all vote Republican.
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8/24/2008 3:59 pm |
My apologies Jeff I did not know you had not seen the entire article any way thanks for clearing that up..... Funomeal I agree completely.I was in the Marines when the all-volunteer armed forces went into effect. In the short span of a year or less the esprit d'corps and morale changed dramatically...........We certainly do need more like Sheriff Joe....... "A U.S. Marine by himself is never outnumbered"...Gen. Peter Pace, Chairman JCS, USMC Retired.
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 8/23/2008 5:35 pm |
Bringing back the draft. I fully agree. Our streets in Ireland are gone mad with gun mad young drug addicts and drunks. Some parts of the ountry are worse than others. I think they should all be made to join to army instead of lounging around in prison with more luxury than I'll ever have. What goes on in our prisons is worse than what is going on in the streets, and the reasons they were sent in in the first place. They should be all made tojoin the army where they will get proper training and discipline, which they are obviously not getting at home. i think the felons should be put out in the fields , the chain gangs ,,like the old days...but tell that to the AFL-CIO....sherriff joe in arizona has the right idea, but that's a subject for anohter blog..hahaha
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8/23/2008 4:25 pm |
Come on, I was kidding. Apparently you don't know a gag line when you see one. But you gotta admit, it's been nice not hearing Hillary croaking onto that mike.... Follow the Golden Rule...
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8/23/2008 9:22 am |
Jeff no where did I call him a liar, His opinions are not shared by me and the rubbish/nonsense was you edited the positive out completely. when you consider what commander Butler says what his POW experience meant......"My POW experience was incredibly valuable to me as a life-learning process. It has enriched me immeasurably, though I would never recommend it to others. I still get a kick out of a beautiful blue sky, the ocean, mountains, flowers and even turning the knob on a door to walk through and go anywhere I want. I learned the importance of community from our experience, that people who work together can survive and succeed under the most powerful oppression and adversity. I also learned the importance of love in overcoming hate, peace in overcoming conflict or war and respecting all life as inherently important and worthy of preservation." Commander Butler in expressing his opinion also said which you conveniently omitted was ...."Senator John Sidney McCain, III is a remarkable man who has made enormous personal achievements. And he is a man that I am proud to call a fellow POW who “Returned With Honor.” That’s our POW motto. But since many of you keep asking what I think of him, I’ve decided to write it out. In short, I think John Sidney McCain, III is a good man, but not someone I will vote for in the upcoming election to be our President of the United States.”...........Commander Butler is not a liar and he is entitled to his opinions just like I and you are.....Thanks Jeff for allowing me to tell my side.... I took your labeling Butler's statements "nonsense" to mean that you were disputing their truth. That would amount to calling Butler a liar, although in in an indirect manner. Actually, I did not omit any of Butler's piece. I subsequently found the whole piece posted on another site. And it does contain the passage you say it does: ...."Senator John Sidney McCain, III is a remarkable man who has made enormous personal achievements. And he is a man that I am proud to call a fellow POW who “Returned With Honor.” Thanks for commenting, Richard. If Liberals really hated America, we'd all vote Republican.
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8/23/2008 9:17 am |
Voting for reasons like this is why we are in deep s h i t now!  If Liberals really hated America, we'd all vote Republican.
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8/22/2008 7:20 am |
At one time I would have agreed with Ohio...but it was pointed out to me, in graphic language by an ex-SAS Officer, "that the bleeping public have a bleeping nerve expecting the army to take on all the misfits of society. It is not the army's bleeping function to take on the dregs of a weak undisciplined bleeping society and knock them into bleeping shape to suit." Of course, that was in Britain where (as far as I know) a police record rules out enlistment in the military forces. But believe me, that officer made me consider the practicalities of drafting criminals...especially in those numbers! From what has been said in various blogs and internet forwards, 82% of all American crime is perpetrated by black/Hispanic criminals. I dont know how many millions of people that might be...but would assume that drafting them would create a whole new range of problems. For instance...how many people would have confidence in a military composed of what purportedly amounts to most of the criminals in America? Would you trust such and army? Would the rest of the world? Would they have the same pay and conditions, job training? If so, is that fair...or, if not...is that fair? Who would guard them...because, let's face it, you cannot force human beings into loyalty, or respect. Drafting them, might rehabilitate them...but definitely not all. And what about the soldiers serving of their own free will...is any of that fair to them? Just a few thoughts that occurred to me while pondering all sides of this issue. Amazing how it all seems so simple, till you get down to the whys and wherefores, lol!
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8/22/2008 5:57 am |
I'll take Obama over Hillary anytime, if for no other reason than because his voice doesn't sound like a shovel against a rock. Follow the Golden Rule...
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 8/22/2008 5:25 am |
Bringing back the draft. I fully agree. Our streets in Ireland are gone mad with gun mad young drug addicts and drunks. Some parts of the ountry are worse than others. I think they should all be made to join to army instead of lounging around in prison with more luxury than I'll ever have. What goes on in our prisons is worse than what is going on in the streets, and the reasons they were sent in in the first place. They should be all made tojoin the army where they will get proper training and discipline, which they are obviously not getting at home.
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8/22/2008 4:59 am |
And , whats so bad about bringing back the draft ?? iam all for it, it will empty the streets of all the young people who drop out of school and hopefully teaches them that life isnt a free ride in theyre parents home .
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8/21/2008 4:12 pm |
Jeff no where did I call him a liar, His opinions are not shared by me and the rubbish/nonsense was you edited the positive out completely. when you consider what commander Butler says what his POW experience meant......"My POW experience was incredibly valuable to me as a life-learning process. It has enriched me immeasurably, though I would never recommend it to others. I still get a kick out of a beautiful blue sky, the ocean, mountains, flowers and even turning the knob on a door to walk through and go anywhere I want. I learned the importance of community from our experience, that people who work together can survive and succeed under the most powerful oppression and adversity. I also learned the importance of love in overcoming hate, peace in overcoming conflict or war and respecting all life as inherently important and worthy of preservation." Commander Butler in expressing his opinion also said which you conveniently omitted was ...."Senator John Sidney McCain, III is a remarkable man who has made enormous personal achievements. And he is a man that I am proud to call a fellow POW who “Returned With Honor.” That’s our POW motto. But since many of you keep asking what I think of him, I’ve decided to write it out. In short, I think John Sidney McCain, III is a good man, but not someone I will vote for in the upcoming election to be our President of the United States.”...........Commander Butler is not a liar and he is entitled to his opinions just like I and you are.....Thanks Jeff for allowing me to tell my side.... "A U.S. Marine by himself is never outnumbered"...Gen. Peter Pace, Chairman JCS, USMC Retired.
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8/21/2008 10:04 am |
So you wanted the Obamalama to run against McCain, well you got what you wanted, now let's see if he can win against McCain....Maybe the debates will show us what we need to see and hear.... Neither Obama or McCain do well without the telepromters in front of their faces.... If Liberals really hated America, we'd all vote Republican.
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8/21/2008 10:00 am |
Absolute rubbish and you should be ashamed for posting this nonsense. But thats ok you will only convince the left wing loonies that Senator McCain is not fit to be the next President I assume your reply means you're calling Annapolis graduate, U.S. Navy veteran, and ex-POW Phillip Butler a liar. That's not very patriotic of you. Obviously the truth has hit a nerve. If Liberals really hated America, we'd all vote Republican.
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8/21/2008 9:55 am |
If war heroism is a major qualification for the US presidency, then Audie Murphy and not Dwight Eisenhower should have got the job. If Liberals really hated America, we'd all vote Republican.
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8/21/2008 8:35 am |
If war heroism is a major qualification for the US presidency, then Audie Murphy and not Dwight Eisenhower should have got the job.
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8/21/2008 1:10 am |
This is more or less what I've read too Jeff...by other authors. It's definitely not just one person saying these things. His behaviour in public is often bizarre, which is also troubling. Apart from that, there's the question of the stamina, and physical strength it must take to do the job. If a man is considered too old for even a desk job in the military, why is he considered fit to be President? A much more stressful job, surely? I have to agree that being awarded medals for heroism in a war doesn't ensure the man is fit to be President. After all, Vietnam was many years ago, men change in that time. A good case in point, is Adolf Hitler...he was regarded as a hero and awarded two Iron Crosses in WW1...we all know what he did later. The thought of McCain in close vicinity to that "red button" also gives me the screaming heebie jeebies. Meanwhile, the world is on a knife-edge.
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8/21/2008 1:07 am |
60min, when we put people on a pedestal, we mostly end up with egg on our face...because we give them pressures they can't live up to. I've done it many times in the past...I learned the hard way. Your belief in idolising your heroes may be endearing, but it's foolish because you end up expecting too much of them...and blaming everyone else when you find they have feet of clay. They are human beings, and like all of us, imperfect. Every single human has something they would not wish to be known...Bush and McCain are no exception. That's life. You seem to think it's fine for Republicans to state "facts" about Democrats or looney Liberals...like calling Obama a racist...but when non Republicans do it, they are liars. As I've said before, freedom of speech is only for Republicans...in your mind. And that's totally against the Constitution you profess to uphold. Incidentally, I also read that GW Bush deserted during the Vietnam war. Not sure the person had that right...surely he couldn't have become President with that on his record? Maybe the person who made the statement was speaking figuratively.
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8/20/2008 11:23 pm |
Given his traumatic military experience and over 5 years as a P.O.W. He earned his early retirement 3 decades ago? He should enjoy it and volunteer at a VFW Center..
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8/20/2008 8:09 pm |
Absolute rubbish and you should be ashamed for posting this nonsense. But thats ok you will only convince the left wing loonies that Senator McCain is not fit to be the next President Notice that Jeff provided the source of the information he posted?  The positive is there. Sometimes it's just hard to find.
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8/20/2008 7:12 pm |
Absolute rubbish and you should be ashamed for posting this nonsense. But thats ok you will only convince the left wing loonies that Senator McCain is not fit to be the next President "A U.S. Marine by himself is never outnumbered"...Gen. Peter Pace, Chairman JCS, USMC Retired.
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8/20/2008 6:50 pm |
PS. Great pic also! The positive is there. Sometimes it's just hard to find.
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8/20/2008 6:49 pm |
Jeff ~~ As always, great post/blog. Thanks. The positive is there. Sometimes it's just hard to find.
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8/20/2008 6:20 pm |
Jeff: did ya see he agreed with a lady in New Mexico today that we should bring back the draft? wonder how this will play in Peoria lol
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8/20/2008 5:08 pm |
Jeff .... Interesting perspective, huh? Thanks for this post.
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